Of Welsh Language and Anglo-Centricism: a response

So! Today, I’m going to devote a blog post to replying to Patrick McGuinness who made a contribution to my blog post of a couple of days ago about banning the use of the word Anglo-centric. I hope the response, whilst addressed to him, has some enjoyment to any reading it who are not Patrick.

Thanks for your response, Patrick. It is a long, well-thought out post and I hope I can respond to it with the respect it deserves. I’ve basically put into separate paragraphs, your comment. It was a very interesting comment, which is why I am responding to it like this!

First, you make great play of one unpleasant experience, and then suggest that this is endemic to Welsh-speakers. That is your suggestion. It's like me saying that the letter in yesterday's Western Mail from some idiot in Barry about Welsh-speakers herding sheep and reciting poetry, or a comment on Betsan Powys's blog that Welsh speakers are 'inbred and inferior', represents English-speaking Welsh people, and that you should be accountable for nasty comments made by someone in your community.

Okay, I cited one example (you then call into question whether this happened, later on – it did, honestly!). There are others. I am sorry to say that there is a view in certain parts of Wales that if you don’t speak Welsh, you are not Welsh. Now I should make absolutely clear that my post was not in any way meant to insinuate that all Welsh-speakers think those who can’t speak Welsh are not Welsh. I’m really sorry if it came across like that. But you have to accept that that tension does exist in Wales (I also strongly criticise that comment on Betsan Powys’s blog about Welsh speakers being ‘inbred and inferior’ – that just isn’t the case, and I hope you accept that in this blog I am trying to articulate a serious problem in Wales, and not make silly points about Welsh speakers).

You conflate one person with an entire community at your peril.

Okay, I accept that point. Of course the entire community is not out to hate English-speaking Welsh people. However as stated above, there is a conflict in Wales between English-speaking Welsh people and Welsh-speaking Welsh people. Either we can pretend it doesn’t exist, or actually debate and discuss the issue. That’s what my blog post was (partly) trying to do.

As for the old 'they told me I wasn't welsh then "proceeded to" speak Welsh all evening' (I love it when you people use that phrase - they don't speak Welsh, they 'proceed to' do it, you see... )

“You people”? What does that mean? Anyway, I apologise if my sentence construction offended or happened to co-incide with other tales from other people. As you can see from my use of “quoth I” and “completed the conversation”, I was re-telling a story that still angers me in a light, jocular way – sorry, I’m still young, and whilst I’m earnest and have been accused of being “self-righteous”, I sometimes do try to relax a bit! My use of “proceed” may have inadvertently utilised a word often used by people whose views on the Welsh language I do not share, but it was wholly inadvertent and accidental, I assure you.

Funny how the old urban myth stays the same: it's always a pub, they always check you don't speak Welsh, then they always 'proceed to' speak Welsh to exclude you. If I had a pound for the number of times I've heard that, or a variant on it, I'd be able to make a large legal donation to Lib Dem funds.

Nah, she didn’t check we didn’t speak Welsh. I didn’t say that. She checked I was from Newport. I also hope you acknowledged my words, “no, I don't challenge her right to speak Welsh, she can feel free to speak it as much as she likes - my issue is with her rude nature and dismissive actions, not her language” The point here was not a Welsh-woman speaking Welsh in her own country. I’d have to be pretty nasty to criticise that! No, my point here was the general dismissive approach she had towards me. I do assure you this story happened – I can get witnesses to back it up if you’d like. The amount of people from South Wales who have experienced similar reactions when in North Wales is quite high (and, to be fair, I am sure people from North Wales experience different exclusionary behaviour when they visit South Wales), so it isn’t something that should just be dismissed as “an urban myth”.

For what it's worth, I'm English, live in Caernarfon (probably the "middle of nowhere" in your terms...)...

Don’t confuse me with my brother! :D I don’t think it’s in the “middle of nowhere”. It’s certainly “in the middle of lots of countryside”, it’s certainly “in the middle of an area with poor transport links”, “in the middle of culture and beauty”, “in the middle of wonderful history”, along with any other number of descriptions we can attach to it. As I said in my post, people have criticised Newport for centuries. It’s something we take on board and live with. As I also said, I don’t think my brother was criticising Bala. And I don’t think I need to say that I haven’t criticised any part of Wales in any way! I love my country, all parts of it, equally.

But to avoid addressing some serious issues is to ignore real problems in Wales. How can we get a decent response from the Assembly for example, on transport issues in Mid-Wales, without admitting that there are serious transport issues in Mid-Wales? Should a politician (or a researcher in the Assembly) have to say “there is a slight limitation to transportation in this area of Wales”, or are they allowed to be blunt and clear, and say, “transport is a massive problem in Mid-Wales, and something needs to be done”? In the interests of getting real solutions (effective solutions) for Wales, we need to be able to speak frankly. I know that the issue raised about Bala was not about transport links, I was using a hypothetical situation. If we want our politicians to deal with our problems, we have to expect our politicians to use simple, clear and honest words.

...and have kids at local schools. I've never - not once - encountered any of the hostility you imply is endemic to Welsh-speaking culture. On the contrary. I'm inclined to think that people here try so damn hard to make one feel OK about not speaking Welsh that it's not fair.

I’m glad that you’ve had so many good experiences. I have had many good experiences myself, as well. However, the bad experiences still exist and are quite frequent. Again, my blog post was just raising the issue and suggesting it needs to be openly debated without being dismissed (or worse, being seen as an attack against Welsh culture and language itself!)

I walk into pubs and they 'proceed to' speak in English for my benefit.

I should also add my own good experiences here. On that same holiday we did go back to that pub repeatedly, as the landlords were extremely friendly, spoke to us in English, made us feel welcome. The woman who did not make us feel welcome was obviously a minority. She is, however, part of a significant minority, not just an inconsequential minority. And who can blame her! In that part of Wales, they have suffered for the past century from English subjugation on so many levels. Those times have gone (or are at least going) however, so that hostility should lessen. As long as politics in Wales (and its culture) is willing to acknowledge that divide, we can move closer to being more united. If we keep ignoring it, it will grow wider.

Basically your post is a familiar piece of 'come on Welsh-speakers, apologise for the occasional nasty person I've met' whingeing, with zero sense of how Welsh-hating comments, which are rife, affect the balance of power and the dialogue between cultures. You wouldn't dream of being held accountable for comments like 'Welsh is a toxin and welsh speakers are in a jihad against us' (another choice morsel from Betsan Powyss blog, but you're happy to challenge Welsh-speakers to apologise for some miserable old trout in a pub.

Again, I hope it didn’t come across as an attack against Welsh-speakers. Rather it was trying to acknowledge the gulf that does exist between different sections of Wales – I’m not the sort of person to make these things up. Sure, it’s all anecdotal. It has to be, since no politician in Wales (yet) would dare try to examine the depths and extend of these cultural divides in Wales. I know that makes what I am saying less reliable than an argument backed up with clear statistics and the like. But enough anecdotal evidence does imply that there is some issue here. And the sometimes rabid response of both “sides” also makes it clear there is an issue. So now, I don’t expect Welsh-speakers “as a body” (a body which does not exist, I am sure) to apologise. Any more than I’ll apologise for those disgusting comments on Betsan Powys’s blog. But we have to accept there is a problem! By accepting it and learning how we can deal with it, we can actually form the great and united country Wales should be!

Assuming she exists, because most of the stories like this I hear from people who go to the same pubs as me in Caernarfon are lies.
She does exist. Honest, gov!

You call a historical place in Wales 'the middle of nowhere' and the culture festival 'regressive', then expect everyone to like you. Worse still, as a defence mechanism, you then post comments, like this one, which imply that there's some kind of root illness among Welsh-speakers and that it's their problem.

Well that wasn’t my blog post, it was my brother’s. I’ll leave him to defend his comments, if you don’t mind. I was blogging separately, not as a defence mechanism, but to ask a question about the use of “Anglo-centric” which has become too prevalent as a knock-back, in Welsh politics. I also (as I’ve not said several times) hope I didn’t imply there was some kind of “root illness among Welsh-speakers and that it’s their problem”. No way! Definitely not! That’s so not what I was saying! Please don’t take this too seriously, but “some of my best friends are Welsh-speakers! That was a joke, sorry – in all seriousness, I’m not declaring war against Welsh-speakers, I’m not saying they are responsible for individuals’ rudeness any more than I am responsible for English-speaking rudeness.

But every single person living in Wales today is responsible for forming a tolerant country that can balance the significant differences that exist between North and South, West and East, rural and urban, Welsh-language and English-language. Why is it so hard for people in Wales to accept that these divides exist, and that these divides are dangerous and that if we continue to address these arguments with rabid, ill-thought-out attacks like “Anglo-centric”, these problems will never be addressed?

As for Jeremy's finding the question 'Is he Welsh' 'totally abhorrent', he's obviously led a very sheltered life. I'm asked whether I'm Welsh al the time. I imagine that when you sneer at a place for being in the 'middle of nowhere' and call the Eisteddfod 'regressive', then whether you're Welsh or not has some relevance doesn't it? I mean, they are journalists... I read the article about you and it didn't make any even sub-racist point about your nationality.

But here too, Jeremy is imputing racism or bigotry to the Daily Post merely for asking the question - is that what you mean Jeremy? Do you find the Daily Post racist for asking if you're Welsh? If so, why not say it?

Again, I’m not here to defend my brother. But I would like to ask: would the story have been any different had he been “legally” Welsh? What if he had been a Plaid Cymru AM? Or a Welsh-speaking Plaid Cymru AM? I have a significant suspicion that a Welsh-speaking Plaid Cymru AM could say pretty much what they liked about the Eisteddfod. Because who would dare accuse them of being Anglo-centric?

Are you perhaps trying to divert attention from your original comments?

Nah. Well, I dunno. But my blog post ain’t got nothing to do with Freedom Central, honest, gov! I just find the debate very interesting and wanted to add my own thoughts to a related issue. Honestly. There’s no desire by me to deflect this imaginary flak from someone. I just wanted a question of mine addressed.

After all, nothing works better than firing up the suspicion of the language than a good story about how Welsh-speakers like to use Welsh to exclude us, and it has the merit of changing the goalposts from the original mistake you made.

I’m a different person. My questions about language and Anglo-centricism are completely and utterly separate from any comments made on Freedom Central. I am a student, in Cardiff, and this entire blog is meant to be a place for students (and any others!) to debate, discuss, argue, rant, scream... it is not and will never be, whilst I’m contributing to it, a place to deflect attention from other blogs. You can have that promise in writing. <- right there! :)

Perhaps in your next post you can issue a demand for Welsh speakers to apologise for the nasty woman in the pub?

Well technically, this is my next post, and I’m not issuing that demand!

In Conclusion

I note at the end of this post that there has been no comment about “Anglo-centric”, and what it means, who gets to use it, etc, etc.

Let’s try this: "I find Plaid Cymru despicably Anglo-centric, in Wales. Not only have they delayed and delayed the quest for further devolution of powers (a quest the Liberal Democrats are still engaged on with deep fervour) to fit into a Labour Party agenda... but they have adopted the same policy on top-up fees as a UK Labour Government, obsequiously bowing down to the demands from London. This Anglo-centric, Welsh-betraying party has shown it cannot be trusted."

There, I’ve used Anglo-centric. Did I use it in the right context? Probably not. I don’t like the word as I said. But I’d really like a reply from Plaid Cymru members (or anyone who frequently uses the word), as to what it actually means! Which Anglo are we centring? Is it still a valuable contribution to any debate in Wales, considering we are now engaged in a devolution protest which (if Plaid Cymru will get its flippin’ act together) should continue with further powers... doesn’t that imply the days of Anglo-centricism are well and truly over?

Anyway, I won’t finish the blog post on a combatative note. I hope I’ve been polite yet direct (and sometimes blunt) in my response to your comment, Patrick McGuinness. I really value your comments, they ask difficult questions and really make me think. Feel free to reply as many times as you like, I am interested in a dialogue and a debate (heck, even an argument!). But I’d like use to discuss and debate the real issues, rather than imagined issues where I’m accusing all Welsh-speakers of racism, of elitism, or where I’m demanding their apologies. Because that’s not what my post was about.

I do apologise if it was unclear in my previous post. I’m still young, I’ll grow into clarity! ;)

Thanks for your comment!

~Ol